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Bug #7669

Quirky periodic "twitch" in SAS stability algorithm for pitch

Added by bewing about 8 years ago. Updated over 7 years ago.

Status:
Confirmed
Severity:
Normal
Assignee:
-
Category:
Physics
Target version:
-
Start date:
03/30/2016
% Done:

10%

Version:
KSP Pre-Release - 1.0.5 and earlier
Platform:
Windows
Expansion:
Language:
English (US)
Mod Related:
No
Votes:
Arrow u r green
Arrow d r red

Description

When flying a plane with SAS stability turned on, about every 5 to 30 seconds the pitch control surfaces will instantly swing to maximum deflection -- then they come back under control again. This obviously causes the plane's pitch to change and the pitch control surfaces then try to recompensate for the movement. The instant maximum deflection swing occurs despite any actuator speed limits. The bug does not seem to affect any other axis.

This is a longstanding issue since at least ver 1.0.4.

t1.craft (42.9 KB) t1.craft [email protected] bewing, 03/30/2016 06:35 PM
screenshot32.png (2.13 MB) screenshot32.png another smoke puff after a glitch, from further ahead swjr-swis, 04/09/2016 07:15 PM
screenshot31.png (2.17 MB) screenshot31.png smoke puff from ahead of the craft just above the horizon, right after the glitch swjr-swis, 04/09/2016 07:15 PM
screenshot33.png (2.13 MB) screenshot33.png the same smoke puff as the plane flies right over it. notice it has expanded. swjr-swis, 04/09/2016 07:15 PM
Screenshot from 2016-04-11 16-23-28.png (2.08 MB) Screenshot from 2016-04-11 16-23-28.png VesselModuleMonitor screenshot mjn, 04/11/2016 03:34 PM
s1.craft (86 KB) s1.craft [email protected] bewing, 04/13/2016 09:17 AM
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History

#1 Updated by swjr-swis about 8 years ago

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KSP 1.1.0.1196 x64 Win
KSP 1.0.5 Win

Confirming that this happens both on 1196 and on 1.0.5. Timing it with the example craft, it occurred about every 30-40 seconds for me. It happens very fast, too fast to see the full deflection when on a good framerate, but the stabilization wobling that follows for a second or so is clearly noticeable. Also, if you enable the aero forces in flight (through Alt-F12, Physics, Aero), the sudden wobble in the arrows will be very clear.

Whatever this is, it also causes a sound, like a small far-away explosion. I kept changing sound settings, I tracked it to the ambience sound: with ambience sound set to 0% it is not audible, but with everything except master and ambience set to 0%, you can still hear this small explosive/venting sound every time the glitch happens.

Also, but this doesn't happen quite as regularly: with some regularity, and the lower the altitude the more often it seems to happen, at the same time as the pitch deflection and the sound, sometimes small isolated exhaust 'puffs' appear from a good way ahead of the craft. As if the engine had shortly teleported ahead a few hundred meters for a split second then back again, and the next second the craft is 'flying by' that spot and the few exhaust particles that were emitted there. I don't know how else to explain this, but pay attention and you will see. When they appear, it's always right after the twitch and the sound. I managed to get a few on screenshots, I include them here.

#2 Updated by bewing about 8 years ago

  • Status changed from New to Confirmed
  • % Done changed from 0 to 10

Also, but this doesn't happen quite as regularly: with some regularity, and the lower the altitude the more often it seems to happen, at the same time as the pitch deflection and the sound, sometimes small isolated exhaust 'puffs' appear from a good way ahead of the craft. As if the engine had shortly teleported ahead a few hundred meters for a split second then back again, and the next second the craft is 'flying by' that spot and the few exhaust particles that were emitted there. I don't know how else to explain this, but pay attention and you will see. When they appear, it's always right after the twitch and the sound. I managed to get a few on screenshots, I include them here.

Amazing catch! I never realized that those little cloud things were related to this! I also never noticed the sound, either. Awesome debugging skillz, swjr_swis. Thx for the added info.

#3 Updated by mjn about 8 years ago

15657

I believe this happens when the "floating origin" is shifted. I created a small addon to test this, if you watch the value of "FloatingOrigin.Offset" you'll see whenever you hear the "tshh" noise the value changes.

Here's the link to the source: https://gist.github.com/mjn33/bc80d38b036923c2c6a4c4fbd6ed427b

Here's the link to a pre-built version of that: https://gist.github.com/mjn33/bc80d38b036923c2c6a4c4fbd6ed427b/raw/0e0f4403cf0f772a03bc6776eb54d4918ca0c3c4/VesselModuleMonitor.zip

#4 Updated by bewing about 8 years ago

This plane exhibits the behavior much more often -- at 18km altitude, mach 2, level flight.

#5 Updated by TriggerAu almost 8 years ago

  • Project changed from KSP Pre-Release to Kerbal Space Program
  • Category changed from Aerodynamics to 281
  • Platform Windows added

Moving to KSP as still valid

#6 Updated by orcaman98 over 7 years ago

It's the sneezing!!! Again, from the comments on that forum post! Having a laugh, Trigger? I'm on a roll.

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